Dr. Frank's What's-it

Fuck having kids say the pledge in the first place. I didn't even know what a pledge was when they had me saying that shit, and was kind of confused for a six-year old when I could barely grasp what "pledge" meant and wondered why I promised to have "allegiance" when I learned what that meant soon after. That is the biggest crock of shit.

"Under you belief system" is pretty goofy, but "under God" shouldn't have been inserted in the pledge in the first place. I have no problem with anyone imposing his belief system on anyone else, but adding "under God" really makes that line plod. It reads much better without it.

Didn't they add the under god part in like the 50's or something? Whatever, they should just say "under the gods" I doubt anyone would have a problem with that.

Mark, yes, the Knights of Columbus led a campaign to add "under God" to distinguish the USA from the atheist Soviet Union. No, I'm not kidding. They finally succeeded in 1954. You can look it up on Wikipedia.

Although this story is silly in an "I, state your name" kind of way, I think it turned out to be an interesting experiment. Lots of people were upset, and suddenly had to articulate what upset them and, implicitly, what they value in the Pledge. According to one of the 7th-graders involved, "A bunch of them [the students] believe in God and thought it was wrong for her to change it." Now, assuming these kids aren't deists who believe in a sort of unspecified Greater Being, these actual kids understand the Pledge to be an official, school-sponsored endorsement of their religious beliefs. In other words, it's "government establishment of religion."

And then the final statement by the school system's superintendent: "Adults should not try to influence children with their personal conscience." Coercion is one thing (and maybe implicit in the Pledge all along), but influence? Yeah, wouldn't it be awful for teachers to display a personal conscience to their students...

yeah i was bothered by this attitude too:
"If you have a problem with the pledge, that's your issue," Stevenson said. "Adults should not try to influence children with their personal conscience."
so having children recite the pledge of allegiance every day (yeah, before you even understand the meaning) is not influencing children? right because we come out of the womb waving american flags. sweet god. er, sweet my belief system

I like "under a groove" better.

…and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under a groove?

The Knights of Columbus would never stand for that!

I’ve always thought it would be cool to change the next part…”One nation, under God, INVISIBLE with liberty and justice for all!” Yes, like Wonder Woman’s airplane. How many second graders know what indivisible means? They all know what INVISIBLE means.

Perhaps the most idiotic post of all time.

I agree with the seperation of church and state but on the other hand it was kind of a dick thing for the guidance counselor to do at a middle school. I mean i know i didnt give a shit who was in the government when i was in middle school and that is kind of her just trying to be rebelliouse and push her thoughts around. Plus it said that the plege was optional so nones bieng forced to say "under god" so whats the problem? if it offends you so much just dont say the plege. Man when you think about it its really not a big deal at all either way

under pressure... doom-doom-doom duh-duh-doom-doom.. and then Carrie, the girl I had the biggest crush on all through middle school, breaks out into a solo; the lights dim, the backbeat quickens -- David Bowie appears dressed in white and beckons us to the altar, and I am not afraid...

Even "your belief system" doesn't work. My belief system really has very little to do with us being one indivisable nation. It's just irrelevant information even if you belive in that sort of thing. If you're going to throw "under god" in there (even putting aside that it is rediculously innapropriate) you might as well say:

One nation, with an anual rainfall of 45 cubic cm, indivible, whose cheif exports include wheat and paper products, with liberty and jusice for all.

...Gettin' down just for the funk of it!